Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

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roanoke
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Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by roanoke »

Happy New Year to all!!!

Around this time of year I usually post a reminder that the talking heads always talk up the Big Ten - and that the conference is annually overrated. The “game of the century” heralded by Fox Sports between Michigan and Ohio State was really an SEC game of the week. And not a very good one. They are the only decent teams in a really weak conference (Penn State, I admit, is good, but not elite.) Big ten schools beat up on Northwestern, Rutgers, Nebraska, Indiana and a few MAC schools and are Bowl eligible. When Michigan State and Wisconsin are down - as they were this year - things get pretty ugly.

I did think Ohio State might give Georgia a tough game - they are good - and had a chip on their shoulder. The over was a much safer bet than the points. And that is why I waited to post this annual message for anti-jinx purposes. But, in the end, things did break as they should have. The Big Ten lost - twice.

They got two teams in the Final 4 because they convince voters they are for real each year - and because they play 9 games against their weak selves… and then shudder at the thought of a “2 loss” Alabama getting in. Never mind that OSU and Michigan would have lost multiple times playing a real schedule. Bama and OSU should swap schedules some year and see what happens…

Ironically, not being battle tested ultimately is the Big Ten’s undoing. Not being in any close games is not a badge of honor - it is a sign of playing a patsy schedule. It does cut down on injuries and stress. But when you get thrown in the real fire, you fold. My two cents. Happy New Year.


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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by LawoftheWest »

If my count is correct, so far the SEC is 4-5 in bowl games. Not exactly overwhelming.

I do not like Ohio State, but they should have won last night, except for a blown long field goal. I think their QB, Stroud, outplayed Bennett by a small margin. The Ohio State pass defense was pretty good, until they went from zone coverage to man, where they got beat. Bad coaching decision, in my view.

I thought the Ohio State line play was equal to that of Georgia, on both sides of the ball.

All told an exciting day for playoff football.
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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by roanoke »

Bowl games used to be a decent measure of strength of conference. Not any more.

Half the draftable players skip the bowl games - and the SEC has most of the stud draftees. Florida and UK played without their critical qbs, for example.

It’s a new era. I’m not saying the SEC was at its best this year. But our conference is a heck of a gauntlet. Especially the west.

The top of our conference: Georgia, Bama, Tennessee - they are winning against the best other conferences have to offer.
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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by Labradore »

While I typically think you’re pretty objective and on target Roanoke, I have to admit you seem off base here.

That 2nd quarter Michigan catch called down on the half yard line was a touchdown and a blown call. Ohio State could have / should have made the field goal to win. We very easily could be (& again probably should be) talking today about a Michigan / Ohio Sate rematch for the national title. The performances yesterday did nothing to diminish their justifiable inclusion in the playoff.

Honestly, if we had an all Big Ten national title game pending… would you have written the same post about the overrated Big Ten?
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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by dore74 »

I too thought that OSU were the equal of the Dawgs last night. But agree that Alabama should have been in the final four.

OTOH, while I recognize the ton of differences, glad to see a relatively small (10,000 or so undergrads) private school that isn’t USC or ND make it to the finals.
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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by geeznotagain »

Admittedly I haven’t seen much of Caleb Williams, but you’d have a hard time convincing me that there is a better college QB than Stroud.
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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by roanoke »

Labradore wrote: Sun Jan 01, 2023 4:26 pm While I typically think you’re pretty objective and on target Roanoke, I have to admit you seem off base here.

That 2nd quarter Michigan catch called down on the half yard line was a touchdown and a blown call. Ohio State could have / should have made the field goal to win. We very easily could be (& again probably should be) talking today about a Michigan / Ohio Sate rematch for the national title. The performances yesterday did nothing to diminish their justifiable inclusion in the playoff.

Honestly, if we had an all Big Ten national title game pending… would you have written the same post about the overrated Big Ten?
Fair question - and the answer is: I would have written it differently. But yes - most years big ten outlets complain when 2 SEC teams make it. But SEC teams play a harder schedule. They just do. And when 2 SEC teams make it, one or both SEC teams have made it through.

The big ten comes at us every year like the SEC is overrated and somehow smoke and mirrors. The big ten’s record in the final four is not very good. The SEC, I believe has played in the final game 16 of the last 17 years. Not for no reason.

You are right - I am biased. But I think I’m also right. At the same time, so are you. Ohio State played their hearts out and certainly were a match for Georgia. But they shouldn’t get away with the we only lost one game and we beat everyone by double-digits argument. It just means they had a cakewalk to get to a meaningful game - and then they lost both of them.
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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by commadore »

As for the SEC record, it is normal for many of our 6-6 teams to be playing teams that are 8-4, 9-3 from other conferences. Those games don't seem quite equal either.
6-7 Florida vs 10-3 Oregon State
8-5 Wake Forrest vs 6-7 Missouri
It is like this every year.
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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by cc11316 »

It's no secret that the top SEC teams (Alabama, Georgia and (sigh) UT) are elite and can beat anyone but the second tier teams (LSU, MSU, Ole Miss, etc...) are pretty much equal to most of the other conference teams. So a #12 team like Missouri certainly is susceptible to being beat by a #7/#8 ACC team like Wake. UK to Iowa, Texas Tech to Ole Miss and so on.
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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by dallasdore »

Overall, I agree 1000% with Roanoke. If you look over the past 10-15 years, you tend to see a couple trends. First, the big ten has an abysmal record OOC when matched up in bowl games. They load up on weak teams OOC, then a weak conference, then the media beats their chest about the teams being good when they actually pretty much suck. Look at Michigan, they played nearly the easiest schedule in the country! Not in P5, the country! They had no business being in the playoff, even though they played admirably against a team with players having literally zero post-season experience (not playoff... POSTSEASON!).

As an aside, it's the same thing with basketball. In March madness, no conference has underperformed based on seed more than the big ten. And that is before taking into consideration how much they are overseeded. The big ten regularly gets 7-8 teams in the tourney, in reality they should get maybe 4 in, and seeded accordingly (especially with the dropoff in Michigan State). It's an injustice to deserving teams from other leagues.

The other point that was brought up was about the SEC. Yes, the conference bowl record this year so far is 4-5 with 3 games to go, certainly not typical. However, most years with our tie-ins we normally have SEC3 against another P5 conference 2, SEC4 versus another conference #3, so on and so forth. Point being, we normally line up against higher slotted teams in other conferences in a decisive majority of seasons. We have had multiple postseasons in which the typical SEC bowl record would be 8-5, 9-4 etc.

As a side note, the SEC middling teams who were 6-6 or 7-5 were a bit weak this year. Mizzou, Florida--minus their QB they are a dumpster fire, Kentucky--their star QB and RB sat out the bowl, all stunk it up. Plus Ole Miss apparently didn't get the memo it was actually playing in a bowl game. The SEC record doesn't surprise me this year. Miss State will take care of Illinois tomorrow, but don't be surprised to see Purdue make a game out of it against LSU.
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Re: Happy New Year - and a reminder about the Big Ten

Post by MrMemorial »

I would love to see VU in the Big Ten and to make up for them adding an academic school... they could add WVU for balance.

WVU playing schools in Texas and Oklahoma all the time makes no geographic sense.
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