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NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

For discussion regarding the Vanderbilt Commodores' football program.

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NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by Johnmn555 » Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:25 pm

Here's the Vanderbilt entry from their SEC preview article:

It might surprise some that Vanderbilt has never had a winless season. But now the Commodores meet “Football 2020,” with SEC games only, and the prospect of the big doughnut looms. It has become increasingly apparent that well-meaning and likable coach Derek Mason is in over his head, and the support base is maintaining a steady beat on the war drums. Mason is still getting protection from the administration, and new AD Candice Lee seems in no hurry to pressure her football coach.

Mason, whose team stayed competitive for a couple of years, has dropped 10 of his last 13 vs. the number, and prospects for improvement on last year’s 3-9 straight-up and spread marks appear dim, especially as Mason’s once-respectable defense was overrun in 2019. Changing coordinators will not likely pull Vandy out of its death spiral.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by Troubadore » Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:23 pm

In the spirit of "Deep Thoughts"...

Yep.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by MurofVandy » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:04 am

As long as he is not replaced by Will "Bryce Drew all over again" Healy.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by mathguy » Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:39 am

Johnmn555 wrote:
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:25 pm


Mason, whose team stayed competitive for a couple of years, has dropped 10 of his last 13 vs. the number, and prospects for improvement on last year’s 3-9 straight-up and spread marks appear dim, especially as Mason’s once-respectable defense was overrun in 2019. Changing coordinators will not likely pull Vandy out of its death spiral.
I sarcastically *love* the way their SEC preview article melds analysis of our coach, with our record against the Vegas line for our games.

Because, you know, if we still went 3-9 last year, but were 10-2 vs. the spread, that would be a whole different ball of wax. I mean, we would totally extend his contract for (hypothetically ... I'm not looking up scores and spreads) losing to Alabama by 31 instead of 39 against a 36 point spread.

:roll:
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by Commodoredave » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:09 am

Yup
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by Doreknox » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:27 am

On the money observation by the Post. Who said the art of writing headlines is dead?
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by Johnmn555 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:57 pm

It should be noted that this was an article about betting lines, so of course our performance against the spread was emphasized.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by geeznotagain » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:01 pm

MurofVandy wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:04 am
As long as he is not replaced by Will "Bryce Drew all over again" Healy.
I think it might be time to lighten up on the Bryce Drew bashing just a wee bit.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by Nashmann » Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:15 pm

Yeah I am tired of the Drew bashing...he's gone ok? Now hopefully this is Mason's last year. His 0-10 or 1-9 should(but it won't) be his last!! If you are going to try and raise ANY amount of money for facilities, he has to go.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by Good2BGold » Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:42 pm

geeznotagain wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:01 pm
MurofVandy wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:04 am
As long as he is not replaced by Will "Bryce Drew all over again" Healy.
I think it might be time to lighten up on the Bryce Drew bashing just a wee bit.
Not that I disagree, but if Bryce Drew is being bashed too much considering his worst-ever achievements as VU head coach, then people really need to lighten up on Mason because he hasn't been worst-ever on anything to my knowledge, not to mention the fact he is one of only two coaches to lead the football program to more than one bowl appearance. I know, I know, since it's him, and there are more bowl games now, and he didn't win those bowl games, he's "in over his head." He's in over his head in the same way a person with a knife at a gunfight is in over his head.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by VUPKS » Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:02 pm

Good2BGold wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:42 pm
geeznotagain wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:01 pm
MurofVandy wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:04 am
As long as he is not replaced by Will "Bryce Drew all over again" Healy.
I think it might be time to lighten up on the Bryce Drew bashing just a wee bit.
Not that I disagree, but if Bryce Drew is being bashed too much considering his worst-ever achievements as VU head coach, then people really need to lighten up on Mason because he hasn't been worst-ever on anything to my knowledge, not to mention the fact he is one of only two coaches to lead the football program to more than one bowl appearance. I know, I know, since it's him, and there are more bowl games now, and he didn't win those bowl games, he's "in over his head." He's in over his head in the same way a person with a knife at a gunfight is in over his head.
Franklin found a way to win here. Knife at a gunfight - give me a break!
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by VandyPhile » Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:04 pm

And it only took, what? 60 years? 80? To find that one coach to do what Franklin did? Should be easy to find another one.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by MurofVandy » Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:10 pm

Mason beat ut how many times and went to how many bowls... considering the history of VU football... and people have the unmitigated gall to defend Bryce Drew who not only had the worst run in the history of VU basketball... he had the worst season in 70 years OF SEC BASKETBALL OF ANY COACH AT ANY SCHOOL.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by Good2BGold » Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:14 pm

VUPKS wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:02 pm
Good2BGold wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:42 pm
geeznotagain wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:01 pm


I think it might be time to lighten up on the Bryce Drew bashing just a wee bit.
Not that I disagree, but if Bryce Drew is being bashed too much considering his worst-ever achievements as VU head coach, then people really need to lighten up on Mason because he hasn't been worst-ever on anything to my knowledge, not to mention the fact he is one of only two coaches to lead the football program to more than one bowl appearance. I know, I know, since it's him, and there are more bowl games now, and he didn't win those bowl games, he's "in over his head." He's in over his head in the same way a person with a knife at a gunfight is in over his head.
Franklin found a way to win here. Knife at a gunfight - give me a break!
I don't think you deserve a break if that's all you got.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by charlestonalum » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:32 pm

Mason has done far more with far less tslent against tougher competition than Drew. Give him the credit he deserves. Being the football coach at Vanderbilt is really hard and that is why Franklin wanted and got the hell out.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by charlestonalum » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:32 pm

Mason has done far more with far less tslent against tougher competition than Drew. Give him the credit he deserves. Being the football coach at Vanderbilt is really hard and that is why Franklin wanted and got the hell out.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by charlestonalum » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:32 pm

Mason has done far more with far less tslent against tougher competition than Drew. Give him the credit he deserves. Being the football coach at Vanderbilt is really hard and that is why Franklin wanted and got the hell out.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by cc11316 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:34 pm

geeznotagain wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:01 pm
MurofVandy wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:04 am
As long as he is not replaced by Will "Bryce Drew all over again" Healy.
I think it might be time to lighten up on the Bryce Drew bashing just a wee bit.
Devil's advocate - Drew recruited 2 Five-star and 1 High Four-star recruit (soon to be a first round NBA pick) in a single season on a 13 man roster. How would that project to 85 scholarships on an SEC football team? And ... no cheerleaders necessary as he would do all the clapping himself so not all bad.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by Johnmn555 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:16 pm

I think the NY Post article is interesting because it shows what the consensus is among independent observers outside our fanbase. It's a good thing to check in with that.

Sure, you can say CDM''s results haven't been that bad compared to those of other Vanderbilt coaches, but no other coach (including even Pancoast) inherited a team coming off the three seasons that we had immediately prior to CDM.

"Well meaning, likable, in over his head". Say what you will about McIntyre, (even) Brown, Di Nardo, Dowhower, Widenhofer, Johnson or Franklin, but I don't think you would use such a phrase to describe any of them. Perhaps you might use those words to describe Caldwell. I certainly wouldn't expect to hear a coach described that way after six years in a job.
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Re: NY Post: CDM Well meaning, likable, in over his head

Post by vandy05 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:21 am

Johnmn555 wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:16 pm
I think the NY Post article is interesting because it shows what the consensus is among independent observers outside our fanbase. It's a good thing to check in with that.

Sure, you can say CDM''s results haven't been that bad compared to those of other Vanderbilt coaches, but no other coach (including even Pancoast) inherited a team coming off the three seasons that we had immediately prior to CDM.

"Well meaning, likable, in over his head". Say what you will about McIntyre, (even) Brown, Di Nardo, Dowhower, Widenhofer, Johnson or Franklin, but I don't think you would use such a phrase to describe any of them. Perhaps you might use those words to describe Caldwell. I certainly wouldn't expect to hear a coach described that way after six years in a job.
I'd certainly use those words about Widenhofer and Johnson. That is as far back as my association with VU goes. But those guys were well liked, they meant well and they were not top-notch as coaches go. But I digress, as bashing those men does not make Mason any better or make the case for him.

That being said, I wouldn't use "in over his head" to describe Mason in 2020. And herein lies the difficulty with him. He was in over his head when he set foot on campus in 2014. However, I have observed that he has learned quickly. That doesn't mean he is where he should be. And growth isn't all its cracked up to be when the starting point was so low.
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