Point guard.

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commadore
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Point guard.

Post by commadore »

All the talk pre season has been about Noah Shelby, but today Paul Lewis looked dang good running the point. No idea what his stats were, but he handled the press well.


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Re: Point guard.

Post by Nashmann »

I didn't see Shelby play until 2:26 left in the game. Where was Dia? Yes Lewis handled the ball well. Will back up Manjon(so far). Ansong played well and Keeffe played a lot. Dort didn't show much while in but I think he rebounded ok
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Re: Point guard.

Post by quasidiehardvandyfan »

Was also surprised by Shelby's limited minutes. Dia was out with I believe a sprained ankle, along with Stute. Wouldn't expect to see them suit up.

Thought Ansong looked solid! Lawrence looks good, but that was often the case against lesser competition. Too limited of a sample size to say that he improved, but doesn't look any worse. Trey Thomas was ice cold, while open often. So it goes...



Here were some stats from the game:

Tyrin Lawrence: 14 points, 4 rebounds, 2 steals, 5-9 FG, 1-4 from 3 in 21 min

Ezra Manjon: 10 points, 3 rebounds, 2 assists, 2 steals, 508 FG, 0-1 from 3 in 20 min

Jordan Wright: 10 points, 6 rebounds, 4 assists, 4-10 FG, 2-6 from 3 in 22 min

Emmanuel Ansong: 9 points, 8 rebounds, 4-6 FG in 15 min

Colin Smith: 8 points, 4 rebounds, 2-6 FG, 1-4 from 3 in 24 min

Paul Lewis: 8 points, 4 assists, 3-6 FG, 2-4 from 3 in 20 min

Liam Robbins: 7 points, 4 rebounds, 3-6 FG in 12 min

Lee Dort: 5 points, 8 rebounds, 2-5 FG in 11 min

Trey Thomas: 6 points, 2-12 FG in 16 min

QMB: 4 points, 10 rebounds in 17 min

Miles Keeffe: 5 points, 4 rebounds in 17 min

Vandy shot 42% from the field, 27.6% from 3, 10-20 at FT line, committed 12 TO's

Orange Bassano shot 36.7% from the field, 34.6% from 3, 18 TO's
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Re: Point guard.

Post by underdog74 »

^^^this is a great breakdown. Thanks QDHVF.
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Re: Point guard.

Post by commadore »

quasidiehardvandyfan wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:53 pm Was also surprised by Shelby's limited minutes. Dia was out with I believe a sprained ankle, along with Stute. Wouldn't expect to see them suit up.

Thought Ansong looked solid! Lawrence looks good, but that was often the case against lesser competition. Too limited of a sample size to say that he improved, but doesn't look any worse. Trey Thomas was ice cold, while open often. So it goes...



Here were some stats from the game:

Tyrin Lawrence: 14 points, 4 rebounds, 2 steals, 5-9 FG, 1-4 from 3 in 21 min

Ezra Manjon: 10 points, 3 rebounds, 2 assists, 2 steals, 508 FG, 0-1 from 3 in 20 min

Jordan Wright: 10 points, 6 rebounds, 4 assists, 4-10 FG, 2-6 from 3 in 22 min

Emmanuel Ansong: 9 points, 8 rebounds, 4-6 FG in 15 min

Colin Smith: 8 points, 4 rebounds, 2-6 FG, 1-4 from 3 in 24 min

Paul Lewis: 8 points, 4 assists, 3-6 FG, 2-4 from 3 in 20 min

Liam Robbins: 7 points, 4 rebounds, 3-6 FG in 12 min

Lee Dort: 5 points, 8 rebounds, 2-5 FG in 11 min

Trey Thomas: 6 points, 2-12 FG in 16 min

QMB: 4 points, 10 rebounds in 17 min

Miles Keeffe: 5 points, 4 rebounds in 17 min

Vandy shot 42% from the field, 27.6% from 3, 10-20 at FT line, committed 12 TO's

Orange Bassano shot 36.7% from the field, 34.6% from 3, 18 TO's
Can you tell us anything about this team? College age, higher, lower, whatever you have. Were we playing Alabama State or Kentucky?
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Re: Point guard.

Post by OldDude »

50% from FT is inexcusable
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Re: Point guard.

Post by quasidiehardvandyfan »

Haha, I’m no expert but certainly closer to Alabama state than Kentucky! This team lost to Elon last week 100-55 ( so there’s that.

They appeared to have some height, and I doubt our lineups reflect what we’ll see later in the season (no Stute, Dia, minimal Shelby).

I wouldn’t read too much into the scores of these games; more an opportunity for the team to bond and get some meaningful, competitive practices in ahead of the season.
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Re: Point guard.

Post by Ndorefin »

I believe Manjon is definitely the answer to our point guard question. Not getting to see much of Shelby leaves questions of his point abilities. I wasn’t very impressed with Lewis at the point…there’s no way he’s ready to face D1 pressure, let alone SEC pressure. Of course, he’s just a freshman and should improve, in time, but I foresee Manjon playing a lot of minutes and Wright playing the point (guarded by another 3) when Manjon’s out of the game. Lawrence looked good, as well as Ansong, who is very active. Dort is going to be a beast with more PT and Keeffe was also very active. Smith got the start at 4 and will develop into a solid player, but is more of a 3.

I thought the opposition was a very good shooting team and the final score was a result of our depth wearing them down. They were tall, but not a very good rebounding or defensive team. When we got the rebound, we were off and running, which eventually wore them out. We must remember that Lawrence is basically a Sophomore and this is only his 2nd year playing. He’s tremendously quick and a great athlete. I look for him to be a starter at the 2 guard…..it’s obvious Stack likes him, as he was a starter from the beginning as a Frosh and he sees him everyday. We missed Stute, today, and he really needs to step up this year. He has tremendous potential and I believe our season will parallel his development….he could be an All-Sec performer if he gets his head on straight…otherwise, he will find time in Stack’s doghouse!
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Re: Point guard.

Post by VandyBias »

Ndorefin wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 6:31 pm We missed Stute, today, and he really needs to step up this year. He has tremendous potential and I believe our season will parallel his development….he could be an All-Sec performer if he gets his head on straight…otherwise, he will find time in Stack’s doghouse!
Agreed totally until this.. what are you talking about? Stute hasn’t been in the doghouse since his freshman year and since then has worked his butt off to be one of the best shooters in the country. Bad-mouth our second best player all you want but questioning his work ethic and temperament is ridiculous - Stute plays his role and is the enforcer for a reason, he’s there to get in heads and win Vandy games mentally and physically. If he keeps on the current trend he can be All-SEC for sure - and Stute is never stepping off the gas, believe me.
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Re: Point guard.

Post by Jason94 »

quasidiehardvandyfan wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:53 pm Was also surprised by Shelby's limited minutes. Dia was out with I believe a sprained ankle, along with Stute. Wouldn't expect to see them suit up.

Thought Ansong looked solid! Lawrence looks good, but that was often the case against lesser competition. Too limited of a sample size to say that he improved, but doesn't look any worse. Trey Thomas was ice cold, while open often. So it goes...



Here were some stats from the game:

Tyrin Lawrence: 14 points, 4 rebounds, 2 steals, 5-9 FG, 1-4 from 3 in 21 min

Ezra Manjon: 10 points, 3 rebounds, 2 assists, 2 steals, 508 FG, 0-1 from 3 in 20 min

Jordan Wright: 10 points, 6 rebounds, 4 assists, 4-10 FG, 2-6 from 3 in 22 min

Emmanuel Ansong: 9 points, 8 rebounds, 4-6 FG in 15 min

Colin Smith: 8 points, 4 rebounds, 2-6 FG, 1-4 from 3 in 24 min

Paul Lewis: 8 points, 4 assists, 3-6 FG, 2-4 from 3 in 20 min

Liam Robbins: 7 points, 4 rebounds, 3-6 FG in 12 min

Lee Dort: 5 points, 8 rebounds, 2-5 FG in 11 min

Trey Thomas: 6 points, 2-12 FG in 16 min

QMB: 4 points, 10 rebounds in 17 min

Miles Keeffe: 5 points, 4 rebounds in 17 min

Vandy shot 42% from the field, 27.6% from 3, 10-20 at FT line, committed 12 TO's

Orange Bassano shot 36.7% from the field, 34.6% from 3, 18 TO's
I agree that you cannot extrapolate too much from these games because the level of competition is difficult to quantify and the level of intensity in league play is far greater, and we aren't going to be playing a lot of the players who played today, meaning our rotations are not going to be what they are on this trip. Trey Thomas' line is not particularly heartening, in that he isn't hitting his threes, but the truth is he isn't getting 12 shots in any game this season unless he is on fire. Ansong's rebounding is intriguing - he did play PF last season and might be similar to Mann - undersized but active. This is something he will likely have to change to some extent as 6'-4" PF's don't tend to thrive in the SEC. Maybe Lawrence will thrive with the responsibility of playing point removed from him, assuming that one of the freshmen is a reasonable backup. I would assume that Shelby's limited PT is due to some sort of injury - he is really talented and him not breaking into the rotation this season would surprise me.

Last season we were not very good from the line, and while PIppen had his struggles, he shot far better than the rest of the team did - his average was at 75% while the rest of the team shot 66% from the line. Wright has been a good FT shooter during his time here and should lead the team in FTA. Robbins and QMB will likely get to the line a lot and both will drag down our overall percentage, QMB more so than Robbins. Stute shot the FT's surprisingly poorly, but sample size was small, as it is more of an issue that he didn't get to the line that often than his overall %. Thomas was good be rarely got to the line, while Lawrence was bad while also not getting to the line that often.

There is a fairly good chance that we will be a worse FT shooting team than we were last season, and we weren't that good from the line last season. Not ideal, but not necessarily fatal either.
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Re: Point guard.

Post by Ndorefin »

VandyBias wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 7:32 pm
Ndorefin wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 6:31 pm We missed Stute, today, and he really needs to step up this year. He has tremendous potential and I believe our season will parallel his development….he could be an All-Sec performer if he gets his head on straight…otherwise, he will find time in Stack’s doghouse!
Agreed totally until this.. what are you talking about? Stute hasn’t been in the doghouse since his freshman year and since then has worked his butt off to be one of the best shooters in the country. Bad-mouth our second best player all you want but questioning his work ethic and temperament is ridiculous - Stute plays his role and is the enforcer for a reason, he’s there to get in heads and win Vandy games mentally and physically. If he keeps on the current trend he can be All-SEC for sure - and Stute is never stepping off the gas, believe me.
Calm down!!!! I’m not bad mouthing him and I wholeheartedly agree, as I stated, he could be an All-Sec performer…did you not read that? I never questioned his work ethic….where did you get that??? You’re accusing me of making statements I never made and I don’t appreciate that in the least! I disagree with your statement that he he needs to be the enforcer…that doesn’t help the team at all. It takes him out of his game and he then commits unnecessary fouls which puts him on the bench. I don’t question his aggressive play, but, at times last year, he got into foul trouble with this style. If you don’t agree, that’s fine, but, we need him on the floor! I’m hoping, as he matures, he will recognize his value and become the player you and I both agree he can be!!
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Re: Point guard.

Post by EagleDore »

Thanks for the stats and write ups everyone. It seems like we've got some great potential, and this pre-season opportunity should help coach develop the players and gel the team. Tough learning about so many new guys, but I'm optimistic it will be a good season.
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Re: Point guard. and SG

Post by Hutch37 »

at first i assumed that Lewis was Shelby until I looked up the jersey numbers- he seemed bouncy and had some confidence- not scared to shoot either. We will see what role Shelby will take but I thought lewis was definitely a pleasant surprise and might be an upgrade from last year as our backup PG. What is interesting to me is that in the history of VU hoops we have always seemed to have good SGs- so far with CJS we have cycled a bunch of players in that spot. I am encouraged about lawrence but I wonder what we ask of them that has proven so challenging in finding our main man at that position-
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Re: Point guard.

Post by Nashmann »

This is just my opinion, but the college game, as well as the pro game, has leaned a lot more on the 3 pt scoring. We need to drastically find some consistent 3 pt shooters. Stute of course is one and looked like Wright has worked on his....... Need some more. Lawrence doesn't seem to have improved much although he did hit one. He just likes to attack the basket, Thomas is still too streaky.

These guys play at some level all year round. How can you not improve more year to year? Seems only natural you would. Stute needs to rein in the attitude and stay in the game more. QMB & Liam need to be a little more of a scorer inside. Also, they need to work on free throw shooting. Do they not work on it in the off-season? Also they need to be a threat to score more as it then helps the inside-out threat for someone to hit an open 3 pt shot.
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