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Gotta vent...

For discussion of Vanderbilt Commodores men's basketball games and recruiting.

Moderators: NateSY, KarenYates, Vandyman74, roanoke, VandyWhit, kerrigjl, BrentVU, jfgogold

dotcommie
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by dotcommie » Fri Jan 14, 2022 12:37 pm

And my 62 year old sister-in-law who recently died from covid, and my 79 year old aunt who was unconscious for several months, lost 40 pounds, finally recuperated enough to be up and walking, but has long covid and will never be back to her old vibrant self. I had Preds season tickets for about 9 years. Someone else now has those great seats, but I don't regret it one bit. I have learned the hard way there are more important things in life. Sports are nice, but I like my life better. I think until it hits home, folks just can't understand.
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MrMemorial
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by MrMemorial » Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:05 pm

And my son's 26 year old friend who left behind a wife and 2 year old kid.

This was devastating to my son, so I can't imagine what happened to family of the deceased.

It's shocking that people would trivialize this situation. It's a disgrace to be honest. I wouldn't expect that crap on a rural community college forum, much less one for alums and supporters of Vanderbilt University.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by cjdore » Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:25 pm

Well you fans show your lil card and go to games and I will watch from home!!!
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commadore
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by commadore » Fri Jan 14, 2022 6:29 pm

FayetteDore wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:07 am
cjdore wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 9:23 am
FayetteDore wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 8:31 am
Actually, as I look back at the email, the offer is to "a valued non-basketball season ticket holder and National Commodore Club member" -- "and we’re calling on you to fill those seats with black and gold! ... We look forward to having you and your fellow Commodore fans at Memorial Gymnasium to support the men's basketball team. Please note these tickets are not available for resale."

I'd say they're aiming at a narrow audience not likely to sell them to opposing fans. For all I know, the email only went to to long-time football ticket holders who buy football season tickets every year, as opposed to every other year.

Short of going out and setting up a ticket sales table in the Belle Meade Country Club lobby, I think they're doing their best. (I know that's an outdated stereotype :roll: )
If they were "doing their best" they would admit that the covid restrictions that have been adopted is stupid. Check out any Preds game and you will see a packed house without such draconian restriction. Furthermore, the Omicron variant that is now prevalent presents symptoms akin to a bad cold or a light flu but providing antibodies.
I'll be sure and tell that to my co-worker whose un-vaxed brother died from Covid just after New Years. I'm sure it will give her some comfort to know that his death was akin to a bad cold or light flu and that he now has antibodies, even if he's 6 feet under. Not to mention the two other people who I personally knew who died from Covid -- one last August after 3 weeks in the hospital -- and another in 2020, pre-vaccinations.

For the record, they're letting you in to Memorial Gym if you present your vaccination card.
Your co-worker's brother most likely had the Delta varient. It is still around too.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by MrMemorial » Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:44 pm

commadore wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 6:29 pm
FayetteDore wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:07 am
cjdore wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 9:23 am


If they were "doing their best" they would admit that the covid restrictions that have been adopted is stupid. Check out any Preds game and you will see a packed house without such draconian restriction. Furthermore, the Omicron variant that is now prevalent presents symptoms akin to a bad cold or a light flu but providing antibodies.
I'll be sure and tell that to my co-worker whose un-vaxed brother died from Covid just after New Years. I'm sure it will give her some comfort to know that his death was akin to a bad cold or light flu and that he now has antibodies, even if he's 6 feet under. Not to mention the two other people who I personally knew who died from Covid -- one last August after 3 weeks in the hospital -- and another in 2020, pre-vaccinations.

For the record, they're letting you in to Memorial Gym if you present your vaccination card.
Your co-worker's brother most likely had the Delta varient. It is still around too.
Now that more people are (thankfully) vaccinated, covid is "only" killing about 1900 people a week nationally.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Equal time rebuttal for the anti-science crowd....

Three times more people die from swallowing toothpicks after eating a steak at Sizzler. What are we going to do next? Outlaw toothpicks? Because if you outlaw toothpicks, only outlaws will have them.

(sarcasm alert)
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by VandyWhit » Sat Jan 15, 2022 4:45 pm

MrMemorial wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:44 pm
commadore wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 6:29 pm
FayetteDore wrote:
Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:07 am


I'll be sure and tell that to my co-worker whose un-vaxed brother died from Covid just after New Years. I'm sure it will give her some comfort to know that his death was akin to a bad cold or light flu and that he now has antibodies, even if he's 6 feet under. Not to mention the two other people who I personally knew who died from Covid -- one last August after 3 weeks in the hospital -- and another in 2020, pre-vaccinations.

For the record, they're letting you in to Memorial Gym if you present your vaccination card.
Your co-worker's brother most likely had the Delta varient. It is still around too.
Now that more people are (thankfully) vaccinated, covid is "only" killing about 1900 people a week nationally.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Equal time rebuttal for the anti-science crowd....

Three times more people die from swallowing toothpicks after eating a steak at Sizzler. What are we going to do next? Outlaw toothpicks? Because if you outlaw toothpicks, only outlaws will have them.

(sarcasm alert)
Just a data correction - over the past week, the average number of DAILY deaths has been 1900 per day with the trend going up - e.g., 2,980 yesterday.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by alathIN » Sat Jan 15, 2022 7:13 pm

Couple things, from a clinician who's been in practice 27 years and treating covid patients from the beginning.
1. I don't see a coherent rationale behind Vanderbilt's student game attendance policy.
2. The health care and health science community has made some missteps, which is totally to be expected because this thing is still very new and changing all the time. But people who think the missteps are a deliberate socialist conspiracy are not worthy of engagement.
3. My ICU is full, busting at the seams. I still have yet to see a single vaccinated patient in the ICU.
4. On case tracking and data collection, the US got behind from the get go and we still haven't caught up. It's hard to make data based decisions when your data sucks.
5. I suspect that Omicron is more contagious but has lower rates of severe disease and death. We'll probably have the data to know for sure next year, about three variants from now. But, people, lower rates of severe disease and death does not mean 0%. People do still die from this. And when the infection rate is way higher, a lower rate of severe disease and death still means full ICUs and plenty of deaths.
6. People who don't work in hospitals have no idea. We're at a higher level of census and acuity that the first surge last year. The US critical health care system is severely strained, closer to breakdown than at any time in the pandemic.
7. Yes, I know. If you don't work in a hospital or happen to have lost a loved one, this bears no relationship to the world you live in - where this whole thing is just a huge annoyance and a topic to squabble about on social media.
8. It's astonishing how much everyone has suddenly acquired high levels of expertise in medicine and epidemiology. It would never occur to me to tell an electrician with training and certification and 27 years of experience that I know more about wiring than they do. But wow, all of the sudden, out of the blue, I am running into middle management people in the oil business, and an upholstery guy, and a guy who works at the auto parts store, and a retired legal secretary, and they all know more about immunology and public health and infectious disease than I do.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by Ndorefin » Sat Jan 15, 2022 9:03 pm

alathIN wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 7:13 pm
Couple things, from a clinician who's been in practice 27 years and treating covid patients from the beginning.
1. I don't see a coherent rationale behind Vanderbilt's student game attendance policy.
2. The health care and health science community has made some missteps, which is totally to be expected because this thing is still very new and changing all the time. But people who think the missteps are a deliberate socialist conspiracy are not worthy of engagement.
3. My ICU is full, busting at the seams. I still have yet to see a single vaccinated patient in the ICU.
4. On case tracking and data collection, the US got behind from the get go and we still haven't caught up. It's hard to make data based decisions when your data sucks.
5. I suspect that Omicron is more contagious but has lower rates of severe disease and death. We'll probably have the data to know for sure next year, about three variants from now. But, people, lower rates of severe disease and death does not mean 0%. People do still die from this. And when the infection rate is way higher, a lower rate of severe disease and death still means full ICUs and plenty of deaths.
6. People who don't work in hospitals have no idea. We're at a higher level of census and acuity that the first surge last year. The US critical health care system is severely strained, closer to breakdown than at any time in the pandemic.
7. Yes, I know. If you don't work in a hospital or happen to have lost a loved one, this bears no relationship to the world you live in - where this whole thing is just a huge annoyance and a topic to squabble about on social media.
8. It's astonishing how much everyone has suddenly acquired high levels of expertise in medicine and epidemiology. It would never occur to me to tell an electrician with training and certification and 27 years of experience that I know more about wiring than they do. But wow, all of the sudden, out of the blue, I am running into middle management people in the oil business, and an upholstery guy, and a guy who works at the auto parts store, and a retired legal secretary, and they all know more about immunology and public health and infectious disease than I do.
You and your peers are such heroes in my mind! I can’t imagine what it is like to be in your position and hearing all of the negative discourse directed in every direction without recognizing those fighting to save our lives. I have escaped the worst of this pandemic, but I thank God for the Professionals, such as yourself, who are on the front lines on a daily basis. There are so many of you who are risking their lives without an ounce of gratitude from most of us and the rewards for your efforts will never equal the dedication of those in the medical profession during this incomparable time!!! Here’s to you and all the unrecognized true saviors who continue to be forgotten for their service and bravery in the line of duty!!
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by nyyankeeDore » Sat Jan 15, 2022 10:57 pm

alathIN wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 7:13 pm
Couple things, from a clinician who's been in practice 27 years and treating covid patients from the beginning.
1. I don't see a coherent rationale behind Vanderbilt's student game attendance policy.
2. The health care and health science community has made some missteps, which is totally to be expected because this thing is still very new and changing all the time. But people who think the missteps are a deliberate socialist conspiracy are not worthy of engagement.. . .

The seriousness of the covid virus as a killing disease and its being exploited as a means of concentrating political power are not mutually exclusive. Both phenomena can, and in fact do, exist.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by alathIN » Sun Jan 16, 2022 7:09 am

Ndorefin wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 9:03 pm
alathIN wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 7:13 pm
Couple things, from a clinician who's been in practice 27 years and treating covid patients from the beginning.
1. I don't see a coherent rationale behind Vanderbilt's student game attendance policy.
2. The health care and health science community has made some missteps, which is totally to be expected because this thing is still very new and changing all the time. But people who think the missteps are a deliberate socialist conspiracy are not worthy of engagement.
3. My ICU is full, busting at the seams. I still have yet to see a single vaccinated patient in the ICU.
4. On case tracking and data collection, the US got behind from the get go and we still haven't caught up. It's hard to make data based decisions when your data sucks.
5. I suspect that Omicron is more contagious but has lower rates of severe disease and death. We'll probably have the data to know for sure next year, about three variants from now. But, people, lower rates of severe disease and death does not mean 0%. People do still die from this. And when the infection rate is way higher, a lower rate of severe disease and death still means full ICUs and plenty of deaths.
6. People who don't work in hospitals have no idea. We're at a higher level of census and acuity that the first surge last year. The US critical health care system is severely strained, closer to breakdown than at any time in the pandemic.
7. Yes, I know. If you don't work in a hospital or happen to have lost a loved one, this bears no relationship to the world you live in - where this whole thing is just a huge annoyance and a topic to squabble about on social media.
8. It's astonishing how much everyone has suddenly acquired high levels of expertise in medicine and epidemiology. It would never occur to me to tell an electrician with training and certification and 27 years of experience that I know more about wiring than they do. But wow, all of the sudden, out of the blue, I am running into middle management people in the oil business, and an upholstery guy, and a guy who works at the auto parts store, and a retired legal secretary, and they all know more about immunology and public health and infectious disease than I do.
You and your peers are such heroes in my mind! I can’t imagine what it is like to be in your position and hearing all of the negative discourse directed in every direction without recognizing those fighting to save our lives. I have escaped the worst of this pandemic, but I thank God for the Professionals, such as yourself, who are on the front lines on a daily basis. There are so many of you who are risking their lives without an ounce of gratitude from most of us and the rewards for your efforts will never equal the dedication of those in the medical profession during this incomparable time!!! Here’s to you and all the unrecognized true saviors who continue to be forgotten for their service and bravery in the line of duty!!
That is a nice sentiment but personally I just feel lucky that this thing has meant more job security for me than less, as it has for so many others.
Now, nurses who work in the ICU are the heroes to me. I just walk in, make an assessment, write a couple of orders, write a note, and move on. The nurses are in there for the long haul.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by alathIN » Sun Jan 16, 2022 7:13 am

nyyankeeDore wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 10:57 pm
alathIN wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 7:13 pm
Couple things, from a clinician who's been in practice 27 years and treating covid patients from the beginning.
1. I don't see a coherent rationale behind Vanderbilt's student game attendance policy.
2. The health care and health science community has made some missteps, which is totally to be expected because this thing is still very new and changing all the time. But people who think the missteps are a deliberate socialist conspiracy are not worthy of engagement.. . .

The seriousness of the covid virus as a killing disease and its being exploited as a means of concentrating political power are not mutually exclusive. Both phenomena can, and in fact do, exist.
There's some of that.
There's also a political wing who finds it politically expedient to minimize/dismiss the whole thing, and are literally responsible for tens of thousands of deaths.
Anyone on either side who thinks their political party has done well in this is delusional.
To me it has exposed our entire political system and both major parties as totally dysfunctional; worse than incompetent.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by MrMemorial » Sun Jan 16, 2022 7:14 am

alathIN wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 7:13 pm
8. It's astonishing how much everyone has suddenly acquired high levels of expertise in medicine and epidemiology. It would never occur to me to tell an electrician with training and certification and 27 years of experience that I know more about wiring than they do. But wow, all of the sudden, out of the blue, I am running into middle management people in the oil business, and an upholstery guy, and a guy who works at the auto parts store, and a retired legal secretary, and they all know more about immunology and public health and infectious disease than I do.
This actually happened a couple of months ago. I went to the Home Depot in Smyrna to get some extra keys made. The guy's mask was down around his neck. Other store employees wore them correctly. I asked what his deal was about blatantly not using the mask. He stated that "this whole covid thing was a bunch of BS." He added to take ivermectin (what my dog takes to prevent heartworms) and that would cure the covid which he said didn't exist. He also refused to wear a name tag. He game me a false name according to the cashier who said that, no, he obviously had no medical background that she knew of. That his job was to cut keys at the hardware store. And no, he wasn't "joking" about a single word of what he said. It was probably his last day there. Now he'll have time to attend t---p university medical school to major in medicinal Clorox and minor in Ivermectin studies.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by nyyankeeDore » Sun Jan 16, 2022 7:39 am

alathIN wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 7:13 am
nyyankeeDore wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 10:57 pm
alathIN wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 7:13 pm
Couple things, from a clinician who's been in practice 27 years and treating covid patients from the beginning.
1. I don't see a coherent rationale behind Vanderbilt's student game attendance policy.
2. The health care and health science community has made some missteps, which is totally to be expected because this thing is still very new and changing all the time. But people who think the missteps are a deliberate socialist conspiracy are not worthy of engagement.. . .

The seriousness of the covid virus as a killing disease and its being exploited as a means of concentrating political power are not mutually exclusive. Both phenomena can, and in fact do, exist.
There's some of that.
There's also a political wing who finds it politically expedient to minimize/dismiss the whole thing, and are literally responsible for tens of thousands of deaths.
Anyone on either side who thinks their political party has done well in this is delusional.
To me it has exposed our entire political system and both major parties as totally dysfunctional; worse than incompetent.

Thank you for a civil response to someone "not worthy of engagement."
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by BILTMORE » Sun Jan 16, 2022 7:42 pm

Jason94 wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:27 am
charlestonalum wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:00 am
My position on public health has been clearly stated in other threads. I understand the student policy and cannot fault them for doing what most European countries, other schools and businesses are doing with our students. They are doing everything possible to keep the virus at bay among our students, faculty and staff. It is good, sound public health policy and anyone who denies that doesn't know or believe the science, and that is unfortunate.

Having said that about the students, I do believe that the University and Athletic Administration made a drastic mistake in allowing student section seats to be sold. That was a travesty, and has properly been criticized. That policy needs to change before the UT game.

I watched the end of the Stanford upset win over undefeated and top 10 Southern Cal last night, and guess what. About 50 people were in the Stanford gym for the very important game. Obviously Stanford's policy is far more restrictive than Vanderbilt's - the public just wasn't there. Vanderbilt is not Stanford and the SEC is not the PAC 10, but there is a lesson about going all out to prevent the spread of the virus at an indoor event if that is your aim. Maybe we should criticize VU for not banning the public but allowing player family to be seated all around the spacious confines of Memorial.

Yes, the administration has made mistakes and yes, Omicron is real, and undoubtedly some in attendance last night spread the disease to others. I just hope their cases are mild.
That's just the thing though - if you think it is such a public health policy, then eliminate attendance for the games. At least Stanford is being consistent about it instead of looking like they are trying to profit from the situation under the guise of public health. And given that both the CDC and CEO of Pfizer have recently publicly stated that the vaccine is ineffective against preventing spread of the current varient, what science justifies their vaccine policy? If this is truly the health crisis that they think it is, then do what they did last year and play the games in front of empty stands. Otherwise they are looking like they are doing something for the sake of saying they are doing something, while trying to maximize the amount of revenue in the current environment.
Jason - this is dangerous MISINFORMATION that you are spreading regarding vaccines.
Please stop with your antivax agenda. It has serious life and death implications to people who, unfortunately like you, are getting too much of their public health covid-related info from random sources that are making a living feeding the antivax feeding frenzy.

The CEO of Pfizer DID NOT, I repeat, DID NOT blanketly state that the Pfizer vaccine is "ineffective against preventing the spread of the current variant." There is a semblance of that quote that antivaccers are taking out of context and blasting across the internet. He was talking about two doses of vaccine vs three and specifically talking about people with only two doses administered several months ago vs newly vaccinated or people triple boosted.

Here are the facts... should anyone reading this be waffling on their decision to get the vaccine and fear that it's not effective (thanks to misinformed people on the internet).

1) Omicron is in fact the dominant strain, 95% of new cases last week, but is still "only" 59% of cases overall. When VU instituted it's policy, omicron was virtually non-existent.
2) Two doses of pfizer is 60% effective at preventing omicron infection in the first 2-4 weeks after inoculation. That effectiveness quickly drops in subsequent months until about 6-8 months where it's effectiveness against infection is almost zero. However, pfizer vax is over 90% effective at preventing infection against delta and the original strain. That effectiveness holds well over 60% even eight months after getting the shot. Over 60% is more effective than any flu vaccine in the last 15 years!
3) But as the CEO of Pfizer was trying stress in his quote before you butchered it- A THIRD DOSE of pfizer will restart your protection against omicron at around 75%. And... The drop in effectiveness over time is slower than just being double dosed with pfizer.
4) Your protection with two doses of pfizer mixed with a third dose of another vaccine is considerably better. You start out at 80% protected and even 2 months later are above 60%. Remember that's better than any flu vaccine over the last 15 years.
5) There are no peer reviewed studies of moderna's effectiveness against omicron, but anecdotal evidence suggests that it's similar to pfizer. Weak with only two doses. Weaker still with two doses 6-8 months removed, but fairly strong after a third dose.

All that to say -
being recently double dosed provides strong protection against becoming infected with covid in general and yes even against omicron. It is thus EFFECTIVE at preventing the spread the disease to others (you can't spread covid if you never got infected with it.) Being triple boosted offers strong protection against all known strains of the virus (yes including omicron) and thus is EFFECTIVE at preventing the spread of the disease to others.

Then of course is the fact that the vaccines reduce the viral load that an infected person sheds. A vaccinated person has milder infections and their contagiousness is weaker. That is as true for omicron as it was for delta. So again... the vaccines are effective against the spread of the virus.

So.... a venue containing mostly vaccinated people is less of a risk to both the vaccinated and unvaccinated alike.

I would bet a good sum of money that the amount of vaccinated people attending Vandy basketball games right now VASTLY OUTNUMBERs the amount of unvaccinated people showing up with recent negative PCR results.

So to answer your question about the rationale of the policy - there it is.

I beg you - please stop posting about COVID on the internet. You clearly are not getting your information from credible sources. You should know that I have two close family friends who believed too much of this antivax nonsense, refused the vaccine, and then died from delta. Two of their unvaccinated sons contracted same infection and spent weeks in the hospital. Their survival was nothing short of miraculous. So please consider that before you post more bad information about this disease. Or at the very least - please double check the crap your finding on your favorite anti-vax blog against the original source they purport to quote.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by charlestonalum » Mon Jan 17, 2022 6:14 am

BEAT UT - Can we agree on that goal?
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by frstev17 » Mon Jan 17, 2022 6:47 am

Thanks Charleston. It’s not that opinions about Covid are unimportant, but this is a basketball forum after all. The coffee shop is closed.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by Jason94 » Mon Jan 17, 2022 8:59 am

BILTMORE wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 7:42 pm
Jason94 wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:27 am
charlestonalum wrote:
Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:00 am
My position on public health has been clearly stated in other threads. I understand the student policy and cannot fault them for doing what most European countries, other schools and businesses are doing with our students. They are doing everything possible to keep the virus at bay among our students, faculty and staff. It is good, sound public health policy and anyone who denies that doesn't know or believe the science, and that is unfortunate.

Having said that about the students, I do believe that the University and Athletic Administration made a drastic mistake in allowing student section seats to be sold. That was a travesty, and has properly been criticized. That policy needs to change before the UT game.

I watched the end of the Stanford upset win over undefeated and top 10 Southern Cal last night, and guess what. About 50 people were in the Stanford gym for the very important game. Obviously Stanford's policy is far more restrictive than Vanderbilt's - the public just wasn't there. Vanderbilt is not Stanford and the SEC is not the PAC 10, but there is a lesson about going all out to prevent the spread of the virus at an indoor event if that is your aim. Maybe we should criticize VU for not banning the public but allowing player family to be seated all around the spacious confines of Memorial.

Yes, the administration has made mistakes and yes, Omicron is real, and undoubtedly some in attendance last night spread the disease to others. I just hope their cases are mild.
That's just the thing though - if you think it is such a public health policy, then eliminate attendance for the games. At least Stanford is being consistent about it instead of looking like they are trying to profit from the situation under the guise of public health. And given that both the CDC and CEO of Pfizer have recently publicly stated that the vaccine is ineffective against preventing spread of the current varient, what science justifies their vaccine policy? If this is truly the health crisis that they think it is, then do what they did last year and play the games in front of empty stands. Otherwise they are looking like they are doing something for the sake of saying they are doing something, while trying to maximize the amount of revenue in the current environment.
Jason - this is dangerous MISINFORMATION that you are spreading regarding vaccines.
Please stop with your antivax agenda. It has serious life and death implications to people who, unfortunately like you, are getting too much of their public health covid-related info from random sources that are making a living feeding the antivax feeding frenzy.

The CEO of Pfizer DID NOT, I repeat, DID NOT blanketly state that the Pfizer vaccine is "ineffective against preventing the spread of the current variant." There is a semblance of that quote that antivaccers are taking out of context and blasting across the internet. He was talking about two doses of vaccine vs three and specifically talking about people with only two doses administered several months ago vs newly vaccinated or people triple boosted.

Here are the facts... should anyone reading this be waffling on their decision to get the vaccine and fear that it's not effective (thanks to misinformed people on the internet).

1) Omicron is in fact the dominant strain, 95% of new cases last week, but is still "only" 59% of cases overall. When VU instituted it's policy, omicron was virtually non-existent.
2) Two doses of pfizer is 60% effective at preventing omicron infection in the first 2-4 weeks after inoculation. That effectiveness quickly drops in subsequent months until about 6-8 months where it's effectiveness against infection is almost zero. However, pfizer vax is over 90% effective at preventing infection against delta and the original strain. That effectiveness holds well over 60% even eight months after getting the shot. Over 60% is more effective than any flu vaccine in the last 15 years!
3) But as the CEO of Pfizer was trying stress in his quote before you butchered it- A THIRD DOSE of pfizer will restart your protection against omicron at around 75%. And... The drop in effectiveness over time is slower than just being double dosed with pfizer.
4) Your protection with two doses of pfizer mixed with a third dose of another vaccine is considerably better. You start out at 80% protected and even 2 months later are above 60%. Remember that's better than any flu vaccine over the last 15 years.
5) There are no peer reviewed studies of moderna's effectiveness against omicron, but anecdotal evidence suggests that it's similar to pfizer. Weak with only two doses. Weaker still with two doses 6-8 months removed, but fairly strong after a third dose.

All that to say -
being recently double dosed provides strong protection against becoming infected with covid in general and yes even against omicron. It is thus EFFECTIVE at preventing the spread the disease to others (you can't spread covid if you never got infected with it.) Being triple boosted offers strong protection against all known strains of the virus (yes including omicron) and thus is EFFECTIVE at preventing the spread of the disease to others.

Then of course is the fact that the vaccines reduce the viral load that an infected person sheds. A vaccinated person has milder infections and their contagiousness is weaker. That is as true for omicron as it was for delta. So again... the vaccines are effective against the spread of the virus.

So.... a venue containing mostly vaccinated people is less of a risk to both the vaccinated and unvaccinated alike.

I would bet a good sum of money that the amount of vaccinated people attending Vandy basketball games right now VASTLY OUTNUMBERs the amount of unvaccinated people showing up with recent negative PCR results.

So to answer your question about the rationale of the policy - there it is.

I beg you - please stop posting about COVID on the internet. You clearly are not getting your information from credible sources. You should know that I have two close family friends who believed too much of this antivax nonsense, refused the vaccine, and then died from delta. Two of their unvaccinated sons contracted same infection and spent weeks in the hospital. Their survival was nothing short of miraculous. So please consider that before you post more bad information about this disease. Or at the very least - please double check the crap your finding on your favorite anti-vax blog against the original source they purport to quote.
Jeez, that was a lot of energy into a pretty specific comment on the current policy. Regardless, the policy of not allowing vaccinated students attend games is a bad policy, and nothing you posted disproved this point.

Having had covid in 2020 (along with my entire family), I am quite well informed on what covid does or does not do, thank you very much and do not appreciate your classifying my postings as "misinformation". I'm guessing that a lot of what you believe is true is also misinformation, were I so inclined to delve into it. How do you know all of the stuff you just posted - were you involved in the clinical studies and reviewed the raw data? Or are you taking the work of Pfizer and the FDA? Are those two institutions infallible? You say that the vaccine reduces the spread, were those same sources telling you that the vaccine stopped the spread completely? Are you someone who say the science changed (which is a BS statement since science is the discovery of truth, and truth doesn't change, just our understanding of it)? I'd suggest you are the one who needs to reconsider the breath of the sources you rely upon in getting your information.

But back to the original point - does this policy (disallowing students but selling their seats to the general public) ensure that there will be more unvaccinated people in attendance than either a) letting students (who are 100% vaccinated) attend or b) not using their seats at all? 100% it does. So by your own logic, this is a bad policy, which was what you seemed to want to avoid in your rant. I am following the logic of VU that Vaccines are a net positive, and simply noting that their no students at the game policy makes no sense if they are going to open the seats up to the general public.
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commadore
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by commadore » Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:45 am

SOMEBODY PLEASE LOCK THIS THREAD!!!!
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buffy
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by buffy » Mon Jan 17, 2022 4:13 pm

I think it's dumb to sell student tickets to the general public. There is zero logic to it. Are we saying the general public is expendable, so let them get exposed? I'm boosted, but nothing is gonna stop the virus train except the virus. Get on with life.
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Re: Gotta vent...

Post by Golddore68 » Tue Jan 18, 2022 10:53 am

I think there is a lot of misinformation from both sides, but the misinformation from the pro-Vaxx, pro-Biden mandate crowd is insulting and demeaning and also misleading the public.

Both my daughter and I got the vaccine shots and both of us got Covid. I have missed two weeks of work with this. I still am having symptoms.

My ex-girlfriend, who is a nurse in the ICU in Cookeville, told me half of the people in the ER on respirators with Covid are fully vaccinated. There is no statistical difference between getting vaccinated or not, you can still get Covid and still have serious medical effects.

One of my Facebook friends who was vaccinated just passed away a couple of days ago from Covid.

The pro-vax crowd tells you there’s no chance you’ll die or have to go to the ER if you get the vax. This is clearly not true.

The pro-vax crowd tells you if everyone would get vaccinated then Covid would go away. FALSE. Look at Australia, where everyone was mandated to get it. People are still getting the virus there. People are still dying from it there.

Quit preaching to everyone about how bad they are if they choose to get the vax or not get the vax. So far I have seen zero evidence it even makes a difference.

Statistics can be manipulated. Every time I see someone claiming that the virus keeps people out of the emergency room or ICU and keeps people from dying, I’m annoyed, because I know that’s not true.

And there have been hundreds of people who’ve suffered medical issues just because they took the vaccine that their employers are demanding they take. At my job, a pregnant woman had the vaccine and it caused her to go into convulsions and she almost lost her baby.

The vaccine is obviously not doing what it’s supposed to be doing.
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